Hello all,
Let me re-phrase my previous question for those who don't understand what a form of control is. Please make sure to write a well thought out analysis with proper punctuation and grammer. No points for sloppy writing :)
Here's the rephrased version:
Connect the theme of enslavement to Hemingway's Hills like White Elephants.
Or
Dr. Pruss's question "How does Hemingway's short story Hills like White Elephants exemplify the course theme of enslavement"?
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The short story Hills like White Elephants connects to the theme of enslavement because the girl in the story is being controlled by the boy. In the short story the boy repeatedly asks the girl to do something she does not want to do. He asks so much to where he starts to become annoying, so the girl asks him to stop talking, but he doesn’t he keeps asking her. I feel that the girl in this story is a slave to this boy whatever he asks her, she’s supposed to do. In addition to this, I fell that by the girl asking him to stop talking she is finally learning how to stand up for herself and do what she wants to do.
ReplyDeleteThe short story, Hills like White Elephants shows enslavement very well. The girl is enslaved by the boy. Enslavement in this story is shown by the control the boy has over the girl. Although she does not want an abortion, she decides to get one because the boy wants it. She even says that she does not care about herself, she just wants to do what makes the boy happy. This shows that she is not her own person at all. She is completely controlled by the boy because she can not make a her own decision about her body.
ReplyDeleteThe theme of enslavement is shown by the girl being controlled by the boy. The girl even says in the book that she doesn't care about herself and she just wants the man to be happy. It does not even seem like he is pushing for the abortion that hard but yet the girl is not concerned about herself or the life of her child, she just wants the man to be happy
ReplyDeleteThe theme enslavment in the story "Hills Like White Elephants" is portryed in the how the girl acts to the boy for his love and acceptance. The girl in the story wants so badly to be loved by the boy and wants him to approve of what she does,that she will do what ever she asks. It is never clearly stated how the girl feels about the abortion, yet she doesnt not even consider her options she goes with what ever will please him. she even states how she does not even care about her own body at on point.
ReplyDeleteThe theme of enslavement is portrayed in this story through the girl's affection toward the boy. While he has he partially enslaved by asking her to get the abortion; it is mostly her enslaving herself to him for his approval. She wants him therefore, she "I don't care about me" she will do anything to keep him with her. Evidently she has enslaved herself to his whim in exchange for his love.
ReplyDeleteThe theme of enslavement is how the girl is enslaved by the boy. All she cares about is being with the boy and she says she does not care about herself. She is willing to get the abortion in order to stay with him. She would rather give up the child than give up the boy.
ReplyDeleteIn the short story, Hills Like White Elephants, the theme of enslavement is cleary portrayed. You see enslavement through the control that has been placed indirectly on the girl in the story. The control is indirect because the man in the story does not tell the girl straightforward what he would like her to do about the baby, but he gives many hints through the statements that he makes towards the girl. He tells her that it is her decision, but at the same time he goes on and on about how it would be " an awefully simple jig." That statement in itself shows the mans want to get rid of the baby and it places a sense of control on the girl because she wants to make the man happy and she states that she wants them to be alright and happy. This in control and it enslaves the girl not only through the man, but also through herself.
ReplyDeletesame answer as the earlier question but i added stuff and made it more clear:
ReplyDeleteI think the couple was into a very nomadic lifestyle. They both seemed very young and, especially her, naive. The fact that they are drinking throughout the whole story and she's pregnant affirms that. I don't think the man is manipulative at all, I think that he's being put in a very awkward position and doesn't know what exactly to say or what to do. He loves the girl, but he doesn't want a child. A child would change their relationship. But he also wants to support her. He says that all throughout the story. I think that she is just naive and too young to have a child so she knows she should get one but hesitates because she loves him and this might keep him around. I don't think either is being enslaved by the other in any way. In fact I just think they are both a bit confused and in a very tough situation and don't know how to handle it. The women is enslaving herself by saying she doesn't care about herself.
My reaction to this story is a bit negative, I didn't like it. At first I thought maybe she was having some sort of plastic surgery or other simple procedure. The story is very general and I didn't like that at all. I didn't know what I was reading about. Especially when she keeps drinking alcohol, how was i supposed to ever think she was pregnant with her poisoning the baby like that?
The theme of enslavement is evident in this story but I think more along the line of the women enslaving herself. The man does not come off as controlling or manipulative to me. He's probably just stressed and doesn't know hat to say to make this situation right so he's saying whatever he feels will make their relationship better.
-Erin Sawyer
Good interpretation, Erin. In case you decide to defend the man in the story in your Paper, just make sure you prove that with textual references.
ReplyDeleteMichael also had a positive view of the man in the story. Michael, we'd all be very interested to hear your thoughts on this.
You folks are taking risks- as Dr. Pruss would put it, and that's wonderful!
Here are some of my thoughts on the story. Maybe it'll help with our attempt to interpret the text in several ways.
Both the female characters in the stories are referred to as “girls” simply because they are very young and immature. The girl in Hills like White Elephants seems like a lost little girl seeking approval and reassurance from her lover. Her aspect bespeaks emotional dependence on the man who seems to be the decision maker for the most part. He clearly discerns her mere “girl” state of mind in need of his guidance to which he is instinctively eager to oblige. He could be in favor of an abortion in her best interest as well apart from his own. She says she doesn’t care about herself which means she wants to keep her baby, and also reveals a vulnerable “girl”, sweet yet a danger to herself. She believes herself in love and she’s ready to comply with her lover’s decision for that reason.
The man in Hemingway’s story is for abortion maybe because he sees it as an impediment to his lifestyle or maybe he’s not ready to be a father and won’t take responsibility for his actions. He may not be sincere, but he’s frank. He’s selfish, it’s still better than being a hypocrite. He’s manipulative to a certain extent, but the girl is fickle.
The girl in Banks story seems to be just going through the motions without feeling much. In contrast to the somewhat endearing emotional girl in Hills like White Elephants, the girl in Banks’ story is of a rather nonchalant disposition that’s almost irksome especially considering the predicament she’s in. She’s very much a “girl”, misdirected somehow, yet capable of making her own decision. Her reasons to abort the baby could be many but it looks like her mother is a big influence on her decision. A girl involved with a man her father would’ve disapproved of. She comes across a tad inconsiderate towards her man. Has she internalized some of her father’s treatment/perception of the “other”? The man wants to keep the baby while she doesn’t. She doesn’t want to commit? Love is a relative term. Is it even love or just some sort of attachment and dependency in both these stories?
Setting: The railroad station at the crossroads of Ebro valley and dry hills of Barcelona symbolizes the girl’s state of mind. She wants the baby but knows her lover is not keen, and now she’s faced with a difficult choice. She’s at the crossroads and this decision will forever alter her life’s course. Also the train is coming. Will she move on with her current lifestyle or will she tarry a while to think things through. Then again, she loves this man she believes. What would happen if she decided to keep the baby? Would she lose him? Is she ready to forego a part of herself to keep him? Either way it is a hopeless situation for her because she’s not ready for either. She’s still a “girl” who will mature into a woman someday. She goes for the abortion even though she feels it’d change their relationship forever because she’s aware their relationship is about to change in any case, so why not let his wishes be the reason for the same? She finds consolation in the fact that she put his wants before her own unsure wants.
I find that using the term enslavement to define a process in which one limits themselves based on society's norms to be quite ironic. It is obvious that all of the people in the stories we have read thus far are being enslaved by nothing more than their own internal issues, as opposed to someone force-ably commanding them to think a certain way(with the exception of "girl").
ReplyDeleteThis reasoning holds true for the female in Hills Like White Elephants. However, i suppose that for our purposes in this class, we are looking at how one may find themselves in a situation in which they are internally conflicted because of another person's pressure. Ultimately though, i feel that the character's being "enslaved" in the story are feeling so due to their own tragic character flaws.
To avoid confusion i would like to make it clear that my overall hypothesis is that the man is indeed the aggressor in the beginning of the story. He is the first to mention the possibility of an abortion. He persuades her by telling her that the operation is "simple" and "natural". It is just "letting air in".
What i find interesting is that the more the female starts expressing acceptance to the idea, the less assertive the man becomes.
The first sign of the girl's acceptance is when she asks,
"An you think we'll be all right and be happy?"
the man responds
"I know we will. you don't have to be afraid. I've known lots of people that have done it."
the girl replies
"So have I. And afterwords they were all so happy"
then surprisingly the man responds...
"Well, if you don't want to you don't have to. I wouldn't have you do anything you didn't want to..."
The man makes it clear that it is simply his advice on what is best to do, and i feel he is not intentionally putting any additional stress on her to make a decision. He goes on to repeat this idea several more times.
Finally, by the end of the story, the girl is pleading with him to stop talking, while he is still straining to make her realize that he is perfectly willing to go through with it.
This might be reverse psychology, but i honestly cannot tell. What i do know is, there is defiantly a polarized pattern to the conversation.
It is clear in the story that the girl has a low self-esteem. She doesn't care about herself enough to even establish any sort of stance on the issue. Therefore she will inevitably conform to the man's advice. If this female had any sort of self respect or self worth, she could easily work through this problem in a more mature manner.
Your stance beautifully expressed, Michael!
ReplyDeleteI am beginning to feel that we as a class are enslaved by the term "enslavement" as well. I think we should approach the subject matter with a slightly broader perspective so that it allows us to enjoy and understand the stories before we look at them from a highly critical perspective.
It helps to be communicative in this class as our purpose is to pretty much play the devil's advocate in order to look at the subject matter at hand from different perspectives.
I appreciate that you guys are facilitating that endeavor with dialogue on this blog and hopefully more in class as well.